The "fun" of Effexor withdrawal

[Patte Rosebank]

After being on Effexor XR for depression for around 12 years, I am now going through the “fun” of withdrawal syndrome, as I clear the Effexor from my system to prepare it to try Ritalin for ADHD (the newly-discovered root cause of my depression and anxiety).

For the past couple of days, I’ve been “enjoying” all the symptoms: the brain zaps, the vertigo, the headaches, the fatigue, the teariness (great if you’re playing a role that requires you to cry on cue; not so great if you suddenly have to explain why you’re weeping at having just found someone’s lost glove under a theatre seat), the really bizarre dreams…

It seems that Wyeth-Ayerst seriously under-declared the percentage of patients who go through this withdrawal syndrome, and the severity of the symptoms. It also seems that it’s going to take me a lot longer to get off the Effexor before I can start on the Ritalin. Not the 2 weeks that my psych had told me it would take. Nobody ever mentioned how tough it would be to stop taking this drug, but they were right about how quickly I’d see results when I started taking it. I’m pissed off about that. And with all the extra hours I’ve been putting in at work this week, there are a few relevant lines from the movie “Airplane!” (“I guess I chose the wrong day to stop _________ .”) spring to mind. Fortunately, I have a few days off next week, so I can stay at home and not have to explain my new weirdness (as opposed to my regular weirdness, which everyone knows and loves) to anybody.

Nevertheless, this sucks.

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[allovertheplace]

Hi Larynxa

I too have been on effexor for a long time as well and have gone through withdrawal several times as I have gone through various life stages :o). Every time I reduce my dosage I do it veeeerrrrrrrrryyyyyyyyyyyyy slowly now (like over months). But I am on concerta as well as effexor, so is there any reason you can’t do both and gradually taper off the effexor?

and OMG- those bizarre dreams are so strange!!!

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[Patte Rosebank]

I’ve always had really weird dreams. They’re responsible for some of the really weird sketches I’ve written, and really wild costumes I’ve designed. Over the past week or so, as I taper off the Effexor, they’ve gotten weirder, but nothing I’d really call nightmares. My brother once told me that some expert had said, “People can’t read in their dreams.” That’s funny, because I’m always reading books and letters and signage in my dreams. I wonder if this is a case of an expert being wrong, or just more proof that I’m a freak of nature.

My psych and I decided it would be best if I were totally off the Effexor before starting anything else. In this case, that “anything else” is Ritalin, which is, I gather, the standard first drug you try in cases of ADHD.

After reading all the horror stories, and discovering that around 79% of patients experience long and severe withdrawal symptoms when they try to get off Effexor (contrary to the 7% or so that Wyeth-Ayerst was claiming until the FDA ordered it to ‘fess up), I find it rather hilarious is that my psych’s plan for getting me off the Effexor was 10 days at 37.5 (that’s half of my regular dose), a few days at zero, then on to the Ritalin. Especially when so many people report that the withdrawal symptoms continue for months after they’ve been off the drug.

Another funny thing: of the four women who were on duty last night, THREE of us have taken Effexor. So the other two (who are now off Effexor) were able to not only empathize with the brain zaps, wobbliness, and headache I had last night, but were able to tell me what else to expect, and what methods worked best to help them get off the stuff. One just tapered off over a long time. The other used the Prozac method, which she said pretty much eliminated all of the withdrawal symptoms. I must look into this further.

As for me, this morning, I’m feeling a little better. Maybe my nightly dose of Seroquel helped a bit, or maybe I’m getting used to the lower dose I’d created by dumping out half the beads from my last 37.5mg. I still have about a month’s worth of the 75mgs, so I can dump most of the beads out of them, and extend the tapering-off process for myself.

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[allovertheplace]

I’m having a hard time wrapping my head around the idea of reading in dreams…and how would that doctor/person know if you can’t? And if you’re only reading in your ‘mind’, is that really reading? or is that imagining/dreaming about letters and words…(I’m not medicated today; can you tell? ;o) Very fascinating. this makes me laugh- the ADD mind goes from effexor withdrawal to the possiblity of reading in dreams. Love it!

I’m glad you’re feeling better this morning. I can’t believe three out of four of you have taken effexor!

I also know quite a few women who have taken effexor and they also reported significant withdrawal effects. I’d still not change my experience with it, though. It saved me when I was drowning in a pit of despair, and keeps me from going too far down when the weight of dealing with ADHD and life in general gets to be too much (even with concerta). But those brain zaps are the absolute worst. I also got this weird chest heaviness with a kind-of carb craving I get that no amount of cookies can satisfy (I guess that’s the serotonin dropping).

Good luck with the rest of the tapering off and I would love to hear how things go with the ritalin.

:o)

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[Patte Rosebank]

I expect I read in dreams, because I’ve been reading when I’m awake for as long as I can remember. In fact, I can’t even remember learning to read, which explains why I found it hard to be a tutor. If you’ve never had to struggle to learn something, then you don’t have any tricks to pass along, and what’s worse is that you can’t figure out why your students (or your classmates when you’re in elementary school) aren’t picking up on something that came as easily to you as breathing. (This is what happens when your mom was a teacher, and she started teaching you how to read soon after she brought you home from the hospital.) My math abilities, on the other hand…

Effexor helped me a lot during some extremely unpleasant times, too. I just wish I’d at least gotten a heads-up about the likely difficulties in getting off it. Though, if I remember correctly, I was told that since I’d had depression pretty much since I was a kid, I’d probably have to be on Effexor for the rest of my life, so I guess any future withdrawal symptoms wouldn’t have been an issue.

Carb-cravings? I wonder if that’s why I’ve been snarfing down oranges so much lately. 6 big, juicy navel oranges a day! I’ve also found a not-so-healthy thing that satisfies the cravings: Jiffy Corn Muffins (as seen on Food Network’s “Unwrapped”)! The mix is made in Chelsea, Michigan, and if you can’t find the stuff in your local stores (i.e. outside the USA), all you have to do is phone the company and you can buy a case of 24 boxes (each of which makes 6 muffins) directly from them and have it shipped to your door—though for us Canadians, the shipping costs twice as much as the product. Quick & easy to make, and positively delicious to eat when they’re hot from the oven, with a little pat of butter melting into their tender, yellow yumminess. And of course, quite unhealthy. Good thing I usually reach for an orange instead.

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[Patte Rosebank]

After a couple of days of brain zaps & other unpleasantness, I turned to dumping out some of the beads in the Effexor XR capsules, thus reducing the dosage significantly, but not completely stopping it. This is working very well. I’m getting just enough medication to keep the brain zaps, vertigo, and teariness at bay, but still wean myself off the stuff. It may take another few weeks to totally finish the process.

I’m also taking extra Vitamin D (yummy chocolate soft-chews, which are like little rectangular Tootsie Rolls) and several Flax Oil capsules (rich in Omega 3s) a day. These also seem to be helping.

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[allovertheplace]

Hey

thanks for the update. so glad to hear it’s not too bad right now and you’re able to keep most of the zappy crappy stuff away. I find the omega’s are great too. I might need to add chocolate vit d to my regimen, though. I find the sunshine right now also helps to feel a bit more on the bright side. :o)

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[ADDled]

I did the Effexor withdrawal thing recently. It was the worst two months of the worst year in my life.

Maybe Wyeth-Ayerst needs to develop an Effexor withdrawal kit containing capsules with ever diminishing doses and Omega compounds. But, then, we’re dealing (pun intended) with large pharmacuetical companies. For the most part they have produced amazing stuff to help us, but, it’s in their best interest to keep us hooked. And I suppose, in a weird way, hearing about withdrawal symptoms makes us afraid to want to stop, and, using the deterrence of not wanting to experience any of that makes for good sales.

For me, Effexor was losing its “effect” after about 5 years of use. You have to hand it to the drug companies, though, they think of everything. Your Effexor losing its punch? Well, we’ll increase the dosage! More profits for us! A perfect plan: engineer a medicine that loses effectivity during time, then we have to sell your more of the same to stop you from feeling depressed (caused you’ve heard all the stories about people trying to get off our meds…you don’t want to do that now, do you?). Where have we heard that tune before? Maybe cocaine, heroine?

I have been on most of the anti-depressants at one point or another during my attempt to feel “normal”. Imiprimine, Prozac, Paxil, Serzone (the ramping up symptoms were so bad, I couldn’t even begin to imagine what the withdrawal might be like). I don’t think Serzone is even on the market anymore…It was just that bad.

Then came Effexor. Stopping the other AD’s weren’t as bad as Effexor. As a veteran of switching AD’s I sorta knew what to expect. This was beyond my experience, though. Using the internet (I know, a bad place to get medical advice…) I found lots of Effexor related websites discussing the withdrawal effects. I was even considering opening the capsules and removing some of the medication using tweezers as some users have tried!

I’m now on Wellbutrin and from what I understand it’s a better match for people with ADD. So far, I have to agree. My wife recently experienced the Effexor meltdown when she was out of meds for a few days. Cold turkey, I was a horrible thing to watch.

Meds can and lose their efficacy. The only choices are, increasing the dose, or, change meds. But based on my experience with Effexor, if in the future I need to change ADs, I’ll take the time off from work for a few weeks to do the transition. Because my mind couldn’t handle all the demands the world puts on you during this time while changing brain chemistry.

DISCLAIMER: This posting is all my experience and opinion: not based on medical fact. If you are thinking about changing your meds, do so under trusted medical supervision. What works for one person may have a different outcome for someone else. Just be informed and this is all I wanted to do here.

Hope this helps….and good luck.

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[allovertheplace]

Oh, ADDled- the never-ending quest to feel “normal”. My life. God how I love those rare days where I don’t give a crap and actually feel comfortable with who I am. Ah well, it’s all about the journey, right?

Serzone. What lovely memories (insert sarcasm here). I haven’t met anyone face to face who remembers that joy. I remember being in my then-boyfriend’s parents’ living room trying to play some intellectual game, and things weren’t moving so quickly in my intellect (no doubt also due to the lovely depressive symptoms) but that was during the time that you tried an AD for 4-6 weeks (!!!!!). I quickly learned that was ridiculous. I wonder if that drug worked for anyone?

Regarding effexor and drug companies- I know they are shady in many ways and of course profit comes first. And you are taking a certain amount of risk with every foreign substance you put in your body. But…I am so grateful for effexor; it saved my life. And I have been taking it more or less continuously for the past 12 years with varying dosages (i.e. gradually tapering off as low as I could when pregnant/breastfeeding). I have been fortunate in being able to maintain a therapeutic dosage that worked and only needed to go up when life or hormonal stress got in the way. And I will happily take several months to go down on the dosage because of the benefits this drug gives to me. And I’m not writing this in any way to criticize your experience, just to provide my version of a slightly different perspective.

(I love your disclaimer!)

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[ADDled]

To feel “normal”: that’s what everyone expects from us and we try to deliver.

Now that I know what the root cause of my anxiety and depression comes from, I’m beginning to understand more about what’s going on (and has gone on) with me. For the most part, with meds and therapy, I’m content now. Life is good.

My wife fully understands that it’s the ADD that has driven my actions in the past. And ADD still does. But when I catch myself in an ADD moment, I am more cognizant of that and can use counter-measures to correct my behaviour. If I’m unaware my wife later tells me, not to berate, but so that I can learn to recognize these situations earlier. I call it my “brainstyle” in social situations, or at work, just to avoid complications.

Don’t get me wrong, those that need to know about my ADD, know about my ADD. Those that don’t, they don’t know for a reason. This is when I use “brainstyle”.

There are parts that I still struggle, some situations where I cannot “bend the world to me”. My job specifically.

As to Effexor, maybe your brainstyle “chemistry” worked better for you. It’s unfortunate that there is no “one size, fits all” antidepressant for everyone. What a wonderful world that would be! Like aspirin.

Effexor helped me to. In fact all the ADs I been on have helped, generally speaking. ADs are relatively new from a pharmacological sense; there are going to be successes and failures for the industry along the way. All part of the learning curve. I just don’t want to be a guinea pig for “field testing”. I have enough things to deal with from a mental health point of view now.

And from my male perspective, I cannot imagine how a woman deals with all that and being pregnant and all the horomonal stuff that goes on and off. I now know why most of the woman I know can endure anything!

As for Serzone, good riddance. Two weeks into that one and I wanted out. Between the “brain zaps” and the de-realization thing, it was obvious it wasn’t for me. For those who haven’t experienced the brain zaps, it’s kinda like listening to a radio and the loudspeaker keeps shorting out. Or when you’re watching satellite TV during an approaching storm and the TV screen breaks into those tiny pixelated squares before the signal is lost. Good times…

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[Anonymous]

In my experience, the last 75 mg of the Effexor XR withdrawal is the worst. I often reduce the patient by 18.75 mg one month at a time if they have been on the medication for more than a year. It is unclear why this is but it is typical to have emotional mood swings, headaches and significant malaise. The good news is that when you get to around 75 mg, you can make switches to another medication relatively easily which sometimes avoids the withdrawal.

Most AD’s have a shelf life of about three years and then the AD in vogue comes out and everyone switches. Frankly, Prozac is as good as most of them. There really has been no huge advantage in any AD treatment over the years just marketing hype.

Probably the best predictor of response is if someone else in your family has been on an AD and they have done well.

As for combining an AD with a psychostimulant, very common. Best to try the stimulant first and then add the AD. However, be careful of Strattera (nonstimulant) in combination with either Paxil or Prozac as there is a drug interaction

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[Patte Rosebank]

I’m still weaning off the Effexor XR, and dumping out most of the beads. I think I must be down to around 12mg or so. It’s such a tiny amount, but without it, I get all those nasty withdrawal symptoms. I’m going to my GP (since I’d have to wait a month to see my psych) to ask for a prescription of the smallest capsules. In Canada, I think that’s 37.5mg. I’ll also ask about getting some empty capsules, so I can dump the excess beads into them, so I can use them instead of just throwing them away.

Today is my second day taking a single 10mg tablet of the APO generic form of Ritalin in the morning. I haven’t noticed any difference, but it’s still really early, and the dosage is still rather small.

No trouble with sleeping at night, since I’m still taking 25mg of Seroquel a couple of hours before bedtime. I’ve been taking it for about 3 years now, and it’s really helped me stop the racing thoughts so I can drift off to sleep. It usually takes around 12 hours to fully wear off. I wonder if this means I should be taking the Ritalin a couple of hours later, so that the residual Seroquel doesn’t counteract the stimulant effect.

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[Patte Rosebank]

Three weeks later, and I’m still emptying out most of the spansules from the 37.5 mg capsules of Effexor XR. Even though I’m now down to the tiny dose of approximately 10 mg per day, my body still won’t let me go a day without my Effexor “fix”.

The Ritalin is allowing me to focus, though I’m still having trouble with getting started, concentrating, and finishing projects. The tablet seems to wear off after only a couple of hours. When the effect starts wearing off, a cup of coffee revives it for a little longer. I expect that a slightly higher dosage, and the slow-release formula would be more effective.

On top of all this, I have the “fun” of something nasty happening inside my bridgework. Namely, a failed root canal which has caused inflammation of the gum, and a fistula which has formed on the roof of my mouth. I’ve been on potent antibiotics to kill the infection, and I’m going to need oral surgery through the roof of my mouth to access and repair the damaged root of the tooth.

This sucks.

Correction: This blows dead bears.

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[Anonymous]

*BIG HUGS!!!* Man, I really have noticed that Ritalin last like no time at all! I’m taking this crap every four hours and it’s not really doing much for me. I tried a higher dosage but if you have the generalized anxiety that I do that is a BAD IDEA. I’ve had panic attacks that way. Not fun. So basically, I know the feeling at it sucks. I don’t have the effexor issue but you do have my sympathy.

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[Patte Rosebank]

Thanks, JayBird!

I’m not surprised you have generalized anxiety. My entire time at U of T was one long stretch of generalized anxiety and depression. Except for when I was in one of my favourite classes, or involved with New Faces (the New College drama group) or any other drama groups.

The one good thing about my current situation is that the tooth has been root-canalled, so there’s no nerve in it, so it doesn’t hurt. The gum is a little tender, though, and if an endodontist pushes hard on the fistula (abscess thingy) with the pointy end of a dental probe, the patient will feel it to such a degree that she will utter some very colourful expletives.

Of course, when I do go in for this oral surgery, I will NOT be taking a Ritalin. My brain won’t need the extra stimulation.

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