Is your IQ so high it can't be measured? ADHD superpowers

[Outoftune]

For me it would be my ability to connect with horses. It’s almost like I understand what they are thinking. This is atrributed to the fact that I am extremely sensitive. I’m tuned in to the slighest change in feel. This is everything with horses. Something the best trainers in the world have. There is only so much a trainer can accomplish with techniques and a ‘system’ to get to the higher levels of trust and communication with horses to the point that you are tuned in to what they are thinking and visa versa there has to be this thing called ‘feel’. Examples are Klaus Ferdinand Hempfling, Honza Blaha and Jean Francois Pignon.

I understand both sides of the above debate. I don’t think ADD has a direct link to IQ (there are examples of highs, lows and averages within our demographic) and I understand Russell Barkley’s theory of ADD is not a gift etc…

What I believe is that each quality/symptom we posses due to our ADD is 2 dimentional in a sence. For example by extreme sensitivity equals irritability, low tolerance, overreactiveness, thin skinned/taking things personally, and troubles sleeping soundly etc… while at the same time giving me the ability to sence many things other don’t and be able to get through to troubled horeses that others cant. For example my horse was abused and neglected and does not trust humans or other animals. She is a nightmare for anyone else to handle, even bit the vet yesterday. But I can work with her in a huge open field and she follows me, I call her and she comes galloping up to me. She won’t leave me on the trail and I’m the only one she will let brush her or get near her food. She even lets me sit on her hay and will even sleep beside me. Horses are extremely intuitive animals. Working with other horses I have been able to help owners when even they or trainers couldn’t get through to them. For me this is a remarkable ‘power’ because I care so much about horses that have had to endure suffering and am so glad I can help them. I do wish I could watch the news without having to leave the room though. I feel disturbed hearing about any stories of suffering and was given a very hard time growing up and in my work life for not having thicker skin and for crying at the drop of a hat. lol

ADD traights are part of the tapestry that is our individuality

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[Tiddler]

Sherri, the last part of what you’re saying really struck a chord with me. My husband calls it my ’empathy bombs’.

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[Anonymous]

I love this idea of discussing our super power (by the way, I have been on the site for almost three hours, posted to two other threads, have two kids to feed, a bedroom to finish painting- the semi sealed paint can is on the floor with all of the brushes and trays- all of which I slept among last night, and a wedding gift of hand-embroidered tea towels to finish by Thursday, and, oh yeah, that reminds me, I have to find the tripod for our camera, where did I leave it? Did I put it away?…)! I always have called it my super power and only recently have begun to identify the negative attributes of the disorder as part of the disorder and not personality flaws. I tested in the 99th percentile on standardized test all through K-12 schooling with only two areas not at that level but within normal range. I was above grade level in everything but reading comprehension and spelling and at grade level in those two areas. Intelligence masked my ADHD. ADHD does not mean a person is stupid. Yes, when I was first diagnosed at 28, I went through the grieving process where getting the “H” component sent me into an “I’m stupid” depression. But it is so not true. So, I am over that now.

Some of my powers: I know EVERYTHING that is going on in the place where I am. I can fix most anything (solve the problem). I see systems (not my own, of course) and where the problems lie. I see patterns in novels and see the multiple layers of symbolism that can be present in a line of poetry or prose instantaneously and understand the multiple meanings simultaneously. I can make connections between seeming unrelated ideas with tremendous agility (cross disciplinary). I intuit answers (gets me in trouble for cheating because I don’t show the work). I, too, can talk ad nauseum about almost any topic even if it is new to me because its complexities just unfold before my brain. And there is so much more I seem to be amazing at (just don’t look at my desk, in my car, or top of my dresser…)

After a car accident, a head injury had limited my super powers making me “normal”. Because I was still within normal cognitive ranges most domains, the insurance company declared that I wasn’t “impaired” by the injury. Deficits are measured from a normed based line. I had to fight for years to get them to see that taking away things like “my ability to remember everything in great detail” was handicapping me; MY base line might be higher than the average person’s which means a deficit for me will be different. I never used a day planner or address book. I could remember it all. Now, I cannot rely on my memory for much of anything (it is a lot better than after the accident, but not perfect like it used to be). I was IQ tested a couple of times to measure deficit and later recovery. During the tests, some ADHD quirks came out (look at picture then turn it over and draw what you saw- my drawing was so randomly constructed it made the tester laugh to watch me do it). But the coolest test was a complete a shape puzzle blindfolded and then draw the puzzle without ever seeing it. Nailed it! For me this is all about my “hyper-awareness” which is a feature of ADHD.

The memory of EVERYTHING is a compensatory habit that stems from the ADHD. The capacity for it isn’t necessarily part of ADHD. And just because I remember EVERYTHING doesn’t mean I take action on things like paying bills, making dental appointments, sending birthday presents, etc. Because I cannot lie (my kryptonite), I cannot say, “I forgot” when I do miss a birthday or when the collection company calls to get payment on a bill.

The ADHD need for constant stimulation makes me seek out new things to learn all the frickin’ time. This leads to many unfinished “learning tasks” in progress lying around my house. With meds, I now can practice finishing these tasks and putting them away.

I wouldn’t give up my ADHD for anything. I would prefer to mitigate the negative aspects better. And I am getting better. My dishwasher has been emptied this morning and all of the dirty dishes put in. I ran a few loads of laundry yesterday and there is no laundry in the dryer waiting to be folded and only a stack of towels and my kid’s clothes left to put away (although the loads my husband ran before he left for the weekend are still sitting in the laundry basket waiting to be folded, I haven’t managed to practice “finishing other people’s tasks” yet). As smart as I am, I have been on this computer for 3 hours and 40 minutes ( hyper focus anyone?) and need to go.

This site should limit our ability to be on it. Or just give us the option of setting a timer that shuts us out after a certain amount of time. You know we don’t have self control! (My hungry kids cannot even get me to log off! My four year-old just found a bag of chips left on the floor last night to eat for breakfast! – Don’t call CPS, I’m going! I’m going!). 😳

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[Anonymous]

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[kc5jck]

Perhaps so many members here have cats because a) you don’t HAVE to give them a lot of attention and b) if you forget to feed them 🙄 , they can go catch a lizard of bird to eat.

Oh, and c) they have nine lives so you can kill or starve them 😯 multiple times before you have to find a replacement.

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[Anonymous]

Hi there Starrmck………..yup I get that…I don’t know where, or how, we fall on the spectrum but we do. It is very comforting to find somebody who is similar or has similar traits to mine. I understand you have some (what I would call) minor issues around some troublesome ADD traits (as do I) but, generally your much more than pleased with what your ADD-ness brings to the table.

I know there are so many folks here whose traits do not appear to fall where ours do, sometimes I feel very much like the odd person out even here. It is a tiny bit frustrating…….and hard to share sometimes…..because my enthusiasm over my Random/Visionary brain is boundless, I revel in it…..but some, good, good people seem to be troubled…..and I feel for that.

So welcome aboard…..and yes….I am a “Gifty”….and wouldn’t have it any other way. What we see, what we know…..our perception, intuitive thinking, the immediacy of patterns perception, on almost any topic…..all make for an interesting life. Yes, I can also talk with anybody…..about almost anything…no problem. I too, tend to speak in conceptual terms, skipping over the tops of ideas at times… thinking everybody will fill in the details…..so I must be aware to bring conversation down a notch or two….and put some details into my ramblings.

I spell terribly…….and am quite a bozo with complex math, but who cares nobody asks me to do calculus…..EVER!!! My partner says I’m flat surface challenged and can’t stand a flat surface in the house without something(s) on it, much to her dismay!!! My Partner thank-god is a Linear type…and takes care of much of the “administrivia” of our household… she is good at it too!! On the other hand she is liberal enough and artsy enough to enjoy my crazy brain…..so after almost 40 years of partnership we seem to have found a groove. Hahahahah….. so thanks so much for your post…… and I look forward to your posts in the future.

Toofat

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[Wgreen]

For the record:

The following paragraph is excerpted from http://www.continuingedcourses.net/active/courses/course003.php

Apparently, according to clinical studies, ADD does NOT enhance intelligence. If anything, it diminishes it…

“Clinic-referred ADHD children often have lower intelligence than control groups used in these same studies, particularly in verbal intelligence (Barkley, Karlsson, & Pollard, 1985; Mariani & Barkley, 1997; McGee et al., 1992; Moffitt, 1990; Stewart, Pitts, Craig, & Dieruf, 1966; Werry et al., 1987). Differences in IQ have also been found between hyperactive boys and their normal siblings (Halperin & Gittelman, 1982; Tarver-Behring, Barkley, & Karlsson, 1985; Welner, Welner, Stewart, Palkes, & Wish, 1977). The differences found in these studies often range from 7-10 standard score points. Studies using both community samples (Hinshaw, Morrison, Carte, & Cornsweet, 1987; McGee, Williams, & Silva, 1984; Peterson et al., 2001) and behavior-problem samples (Sonuga-Barke, Lamparelli, Stevenson, Thompson, & Henry, 1994) also have found significant negative associations between degree of ADHD and intelligence (rs = -.25-.35). In contrast, associations between ratings of conduct problems and intelligence in children are often much smaller or even nonsignificant, particularly when hyperactive-impulsive behavior is partialed out of the relationship (Hinshaw et al., 1987; Lynam, Moffitt, & Stouthamer-Loeber, 1993; Sonuga-Barke et al., 1994). This implies that the relationship between IQ and ADHD is not likely to be a function of comorbid conduct problems (see Hinshaw, 1992, for a review).”

This is not to say that there aren’t some brilliant ADDers out there. But it does suggest that their brilliance probably has nothing to do with their ADD. Having said that, I wonder how one weights test scores for ADDers who may have trouble concentrating while taking an “IQ” test. And thus another question: What are we to make of aptitude that dwells in the mind but cannot be fully utilized or properly measured because of a “disability?” If a tree falls in a forest…

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[Tiddler]

ADD does not cause a reduction in IQ. It can cause a lowering of IQ SCORES – scores being the relevant word here.

IQ tests are done sitting down, answering questions that the child has had no say in, doing tasks that are not always interesting. One cannot say that IQ is lower in ADD kids because they do badly in IQ TESTS. One can argue that IQ is harder to measure or that children can do worse in the testing. The trick is to ensure that the ADD kid can experience the test in a way that works for him/her. And when tests are done that way, are the results different?

Also, this sounds like full scale IQ, rather than the likely spikes and dips seen in anyone with a specific learning difference. This isn’t about conduct problems but in ability ranges – the ‘genius’ profile of old (they say ‘very superior’ now) was often very spiky – there are particular skill sets that are extreme (off the chart often) and others that are average or below average. This can pull a full scale IQ right down but a good psych will spot this and use a verbal and a practical score for example.

IQ and ADD are not positively or negatively correlated. There’s a range just like any other sample of the community but it may be harder for us to demonstrate our abilities in standard ways (like in standard testing.)

My IQ is extremely high. And, as you say, WGreen, I have been unable to fully utilise it until I got the meds. As a child, I’d have done badly in the tests as I had internalised what I’d been told – that I was lazy and didn’t do anythign well.

So, my questions are:

Are kids with ADHD tested using measures appropriate to them (the answer is no.)

How damaged are the kids by the time they get to the testing stage (the answer is – often – very.)

Is the environment right for the ADHD child – ie can they bounce, walk around, ask questions, do some questions from one test, some from another and go back to the first etc? (the answer is no.)

Let’s look at the problems with IQ testing. It’s impossible to get a very high score if you’re not very intelligent. It is VERY easy to get a low score when you’re much smarter than your score suggests. Lack of education can block results – there are general knowledge questions that are fitting of a private school education for example. A child whose questions are ignored at home and at school may not know why people put money in a bank or what a moth is for example. And a child who does not care why people use a bank or what a moth is may switch off during the test and amuse himself in other ways.

Also, 7-10 points is not even a standard deviation. I would be loath to call that statistically relevant at this age.

ADD does not affect intelligence one way or another but it does affect how we demonstrate and use it – and as you say it might be bugger all use to us if we can’t use it.

My doctor remarked that it was like my son and I were given this extraordinary gift (in our intellect) and it was waved in our faces then we were given something else that would prevent us from using the ‘gift’ in the first place.

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[Anonymous]

Many many people of “different intelligence” and “processing” score poorly to terribly in standardized testing of any type……………..

Not an argument……..jus sayin’………

Toofat

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[Patte Rosebank]

I was tested about 12 years ago, after I’d gone through a year of very traumatic events. At that time, my I.Q. was found to be in the 93rd percentile. That is, only 7% of the population is more intelligent than I am. I might score higher now that my life is much calmer. But I’d still have a lot of trouble with the math and geometry questions.

However, I.Q. is problematic, because the tests measure what the testers define “I.Q.” to be.

In the early years of the 20th Century, the I.Q. tests given to immigrants at Ellis Island (many of whom had never even held a pencil before) included questions like “Who is Babe Ruth?” and “What is Crisco?”

Most of these immigrants had never heard of either—coming, as they did, from tiny villages in Eastern Europe—so they were marked as idiots, morons, or imbeciles—three terms which applied to specific low score ranges on those early tests—which led to the many jokes about Polish people being stupid.

Today, we know that I.Q. (“Intelligence Quotient” – how smart you are) isn’t nearly as important as E.Q. (“Emotional Quotient” – what you can do with it). I suspect that many of us here have high I.Q.s but significantly lower E.Q.s.

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[Wgreen]

I have no idea what my IQ is. But my MQ (Memory Quotient) has now dipped into negative territory. I can’t remember what I had for breakfast. Or what I was going to say next…

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[Tiddler]

my husband’s eq is extremely low – as an aspie. mine is very high. i’ve never really thought about it one way or the other but I suppose it gives a good idea of how we can relate to others – that said I am less and less sure that I am good at any of that…

also, re iq tests – there are othercultural issues too – like explaining what things are and why or how they’re used – for example what is the relationship between a dog and a hare – most people might say they’re both mammals and that may be the ‘correct’ answer, but someone who has observed the dog chasing the hare may mention that link. one thing I had to answer was how monarchy and democracy were similar – what i didn’t mention because i thought it was too obvious was that we have both in our country – yet he was probably looking for that.

and I topped out on one subtest asking me to list all the things of a certain group I could think of – as that is a particular interest of mine i talked faster than he could write, but a different group of things that hadn’t been an interest of mine would have revealed a much lower score.

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[pancakes]

The combination of my undiagnosed ADHD and high IQ has been something that has confused many people. In high school, the majority of lessons were mundane and repetitive. My only response would be squirming in my seat or daydreaming severely or attempting to turn class into an episode of Family Guy via outrageous remarks and antics. Eventually my reputation became that I was a guy who was funny at times but usually annoying, and could never be taken seriously. This only built up a large tower of judgement that would get knocked down sometimes when I correctly answered more difficult questions or correctly solved more difficult problems. Overall, I confused people and was simply dismissed from regard as the result of fitting neither the label of studious nor stupid.

The moral is that being a ghost is worse than being a pile of bricks, unless of course that ghost is named Casper, the friendly ghost who recently got diagnosed with ADHD and is slowly learning to manage his symptoms with the help of the TotallyADD forums.

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