September 28, 2011 at 3:16 am #99161
AnonymousInactiveSeptember 28, 2011 at 3:16 amPost count: 14413
wpgmom, (Or is that winterpgmom?)
I’m glad to hear that your insurer covers the bulk of the cost. School is tough enough for our ADD children and having access to the right med for them can make a world of difference to our kids (and that’s coming from a teacher!). Yessiree, I’ve seen an astounding turnaround for one of my students in the last 2 weeks. Mom can’t stop crying because she is so happy, and dad? Well, he’s changed his tune from “no meds ever, ever!” to “Oh, ohhh…… I think this WAS the right thing!”
We are so fortunate to have so many options to use/try to help us out with our ADD. Really!
I work in a Special Ed class for children with severe behavioural difficulties. ADD is never the reason they are placed with me, just one of many details in their lives. Proper treatment of ADD (however the parents/doctors decide to do so) certainly assists the child in achieving some success while we work on helping them deal with and manage all their other issues. Yeah, I consider myself lucky to just have ADD to deal with.
If a child is helped by the brand name drug as opposed to the generic, I say let it be available to them!REPORT ABUSESeptember 30, 2011 at 10:23 pm #99162
AnonymousInactiveSeptember 30, 2011 at 10:23 pmPost count: 14413
I’m not sure how it’s done in Ontario, but in South Carolina, and any other US state for that matter, it is not within the scope of practice for a pharmacist to override the express wishes of the prescribing physician and simply choose to ignore “Dispense AS Written” designation on a prescription order. The poster who mentioned legal repercussions resulting from such actions is absolutely correct. I could no more ignore the prescribers instructions with regard to brand as I could ignore or make up my own instructions for the patient’s dose! That is the PURPOSE of the order!! To alter in anyway the doctor’s order could not only bring legal action down on my head but I would also lose my license to practice. Even when a patient requests a generic if the prescriber has specified the brand product i call the doctor before complying with patient’s request. As i said, I do not practice in Ontario so I am not sure how it works there but I would be EXTREMELY SHOCKED if it were actually legal for a pharmacist to ignore or change in any way the written order of rthe prescriber!REPORT ABUSEOctober 7, 2011 at 7:24 am #99163
AnonymousInactiveOctober 7, 2011 at 7:24 amPost count: 14413
As a pharmacy technician, I know 2 things about the generic version of Concerta, since I’m in charge of ordering, packaging for unit dosing, etc in the pharmacy. 1. The generic version is EXACTLY the same as the brand name right now, at least in the US. They’re both made by the same company. Concerta is manufactured by ALZA Corporation, and is distributed and marketed by McNeil Pediatrics. Concerta is currently protected by a patent that prevents any generic Concerta from being manufactured. The first patent for Concerta is set to expire in 2018. However, due to a legal settlement between two drug manufacturers, a generic version became available in May 2011. Due to the settlement, Watson Laboratories is allowed to sell an “authorized generic” version of Concerta. This means that the original manufacturer supplies Watson with brand-name Concerta tablets, which Watson packages and sells as a generic drug. Therefore, this generic version is exactly like the brand-name drug in every way, other than it being sold as a generic.
Now as for the pharmacist overriding the doctor’s “No substitutes” request, In Michigan and many other states, this is perfectly legal. In Michigan pharmacy practice, the only way a no substitution is valid is if it is written exactly as dispense as written, in the doctor’s handwriting. Printed copies from a computer are not a valid DAW. Pharmacies are not required to consider a DAW that is checked off on a box, or signed on a different line as substitution permissible. The doctor also cannot write medically necessary on the prescription, and expect a pharmacist to fill it as a brand name, however, a pharmacist may call the doctor after seeing that and find out exactly WHY the brand name is medically necessary. After that phone call, the pharmacist can either choose to fill it for the brand or generic depending on what the doctor says. Also, the pharmacist may also override the DAW as a level 3, where the pharmacist selects the drug. Usually this only happens when a brand name is out of stock or unable to be obtained.
As for the “Real Deal” comment, generic drugs are also the real deal. They just cost less, and people don’t like the word generic. I challenge you to find something like motrin 800 brand name at any pharmacy. You won’t find it anywhere, because it doesn’t exist anymore. Ibuprofen is so prevalent now that there is no reason for a manufacturer to make the brand name anymore. Those are my 2 cents (which are correct, by the way)REPORT ABUSEOctober 8, 2011 at 6:12 pm #99164
AnonymousInactiveOctober 8, 2011 at 6:12 pmPost count: 14413
I noticed that this topic is 9 months old but things have changed since May. I did the research…Just like dtlehmai posted yesterday, the generic sold by Watson is exactly the same and is also manufactured by ALZA. My pharmacy said they quit carrying Concerta because the new generic is working with no complaints. I had to quit Vyvanse due to an allergy. Today is day one for me on the Watson generic, and I am keeping my fingers crossed. Wish me luck!REPORT ABUSEOctober 8, 2011 at 6:58 pm #99165
dartmouthkittykatMemberOctober 8, 2011 at 6:58 pmPost count: 4
Yes, the medication contained within each pill is exactly the same for the Concerta and the Generic. The DIFFERENCE is the time release coating/structure of the pill. This is the part of the medication that is under patent and cannot be copied by the Generic. This is what causes the drastic differences in the effects of the Concerta and it’s Generic. Both my son and I have ADHD and we both had extremely positive results on the Concerta. However, in the summer (here in Canada), the generic form of Concerta was approved and pharmacists were permitted to provide the generic when Concerta was prescribed – as dictated by the Medical Insurance Providers.
The differences in the effects of the Generic from the Concerta were immediately evident for both of us. We found a dramatic decrease in our ability to focus, the “ticks” came out in full force and the feelings of anxiety and anger were unreal. Just in case anyone is thinking that the results were compromised by the knowledge of taking a generic – my son had no idea – he didn’t even notice the difference in the shape of the pill. My husband was also unaware of the change in medication and it did not take long for him to comment on the change in our behavior.
When we reported the changes to our doctor, she confirmed that although the Generic Concerta does work for some – the majority do not have a positive experience. She has written “No substitutions” on our prescriptions since and we have had no problems with the pharmacy and the Concerta is back to being a positive influence in our lives.
Generic is not always better – sometimes it is, but in this case we found that it was not.REPORT ABUSEOctober 8, 2011 at 7:35 pm #99166
AnonymousInactiveOctober 8, 2011 at 7:35 pmPost count: 14413
I did a little bit of research, and from what I have read, The US and Canada have completely different generic Concerta.
The US generic is pretty much the exact same thing as the name brand. It’s still made by ALZA, it’s just sold by Watson under the generic name, Methylphenidate HCL. Last month I was on the “Name Brand” Concerta and this month I was given the generic. It’s the exact same pill. Same shape, sample ALZA 27 imprint, everything. There seems to be absolutely nothing different about it other than the price. And even then, the actual cost is the same – $190.00 on both the generic and brand name. My copay was much cheaper on the “generic” even though the total cost was the same.
In Canada, however, it appears as though it’s a different story. It’s the same active ingredient, but it is, in fact different time release methods. The generic name in Canada is Novo-Methylphenidate ER-C (I think the name may have changed to Teva-Mehtylphenidate ER-C). So…it seems as though it’s 2 completely different cases.
My Psych NP actually said that no one has actually been prescribing the name brand since the generic is no different than the brand name – in active ingredient or the high-tech release method.
So, here’s my dilemma: I started on 27mg of Concerta, once daily, in August. It was amazing, and the first day was like someone lit a fire under my butt and I suddenly enjoyed my job again. The amount of focus I had was insane and for that first month…I felt like a normal person. I got my work done, I prioritized well, I didn’t procrastinate anything, and I found myself with true free time. I did tell my NP that I get a bit irritable around 3pm because I take the Concerta so early in the morning. She gave me 10mg of plain old fast acting Ritalin for the afternoon.
One Tuesday of last week, I started noticing that I was slipping into my old habits of procrastinating, unable to focus on the task at hand, allowing myself to get distracted, and of course, really tired all of the time. My GP’s nurse said it’s very common to develop a tolerance and I might need the higher dose, but I didn’t anticipate it happening this soon. At first I thought it was because I had been taking the “generic” for the last week, but by all the research I’ve done, there is seriously no difference here in the US.
Is this “normal” that I would develope a tolerance and suddenly not feel any benefits from the meds? Is it possible that because I was taking the regular 10mg Ritalin in the afternoon that my body might not be getting the same benefits from the time release Concerta? yesterday at work I actually had to take 3 of my Ritalin after already taking my morning Concerta: and 10am, 1pm and 3pm. I’m just not even sure where to go from here! I’m so frustrated because I felt so great for a month and now…well, i forgot how awful I felt before!REPORT ABUSEOctober 24, 2011 at 6:56 pm #99168
AnonymousInactiveOctober 24, 2011 at 6:56 pmPost count: 14413
SuzyBear — “tolerance” is a complicated issue.
It could be that the novelty of increased ability to control your attention …. got your attention! At least for a while.
But it could be so many other things, too.
Your fatigue is one red flag that something else might be amiss (how’s your sleep, for example, and are you eating protein in the morning?)
Another red flag: the irritability in the late afternoon. That might mean you need a booster dose earlier in the day, before the first dose wears off. But it might also mean that the stimulant is backsuppressing serotonin (to put it simply) and thus increasing challenges around serotonin.
You might also find that you benefit from amino-acid support as well as a good vitamin-mineral supplement. These are all the building blocks of neurotransmitters and signal transmission.REPORT ABUSENovember 15, 2011 at 4:01 am #99169
AnonymousInactiveNovember 15, 2011 at 4:01 amPost count: 14413November 15, 2011 at 11:24 am #99170
trashmanMemberNovember 15, 2011 at 11:24 amPost count: 546
its a great place . the more you read hear the more you learn . you will find a lot of info here . hope you like reading and welcome. the more you learn the more you can help people and thats great. I don’t know if you are allowed,but you could allways send people here to totallyadd.com . so once again welcome.REPORT ABUSENovember 17, 2011 at 12:36 am #99171
caperMemberNovember 17, 2011 at 12:36 amPost count: 179
Health Canada approves drugs based on “bioequivalence”, which means a generic has to have the same (80-125%) amount of drug absorbed by the body and the same (80-125%) peak level in the body.
Pharmacokinetic equivalence is more than that; the time of the peak levels and the time to drop to half levels need to be considered for pharmacokinetic equivalence. Insurance companies tend to look only at bioequivalence of generics and not pharmacokinetic equivalence.REPORT ABUSEDecember 4, 2011 at 3:35 am #99172
AnonymousInactiveDecember 4, 2011 at 3:35 amPost count: 14413
Teva (Novo) -Methylphenidate ER-C is most definitely not equivalent to Concerta. They both have different release mechanisms as well as different drug release profiles.REPORT ABUSEDecember 4, 2011 at 6:34 am #99173
AnonymousInactiveDecember 4, 2011 at 6:34 amPost count: 14413
Not to hijack, but the Straterra I am on also has a generic version, made and distrubuted in Canada
by the same drug company that has the licence to make Straterra and Welbutrin and the generics.
I have no real clue here, had to ask a very helpful pharmacist in our med center in B.C., Canada.
Different rules on drugs out here. Straterra is not covered by drug plans. Which may be why
I am able to ask for and get either in B.C., it is relatively new and expensive.
I had equivalence explained, and what i remember is that humans are so diverse that
each can react differently to the same drug. And ADHD is not a simple thing to medicate.
I don’t know enough chemistry to even begin to follow or assess the information I found.
The half life of Straterra is 5 hours, same with the generic, and both the psych and the doctor
said that the drug would be in my system for over 12 hours.
How does someone without a science background get an informed opinion without asking the people
involved in selling or distributing the drugs? I wouldn’t rely on our government to do that job.
So how ? Thanks .REPORT ABUSEDecember 6, 2011 at 4:40 pm #99174
AnonymousInactiveDecember 6, 2011 at 4:40 pmPost count: 14413
I have been researching this topic for days and was glad to find this post/thread. I thought I was going a little crazy. I have been on Concerta for months, and just this month (2 weeks ago) I was given the generic for the first time. The pharmacist did ask me if I wanted it and after seeing the price difference to me, of course I said ok.
Well…2 weeks later, I am seriously considering going back to the brand name for next month. I felt great over the last few months after spending several months adjusting my dose with my doctor. This month, I am constantly on edge, feel very anxious, am not focusing at all, i am back to procrastinating again, I can’t sleep, have the worst heartburn every and the dry mouth is obnoxious. It is to the point where I am skipping days to get a break from the side effects.
Has anyone else had any of these issues and did going back to name brand help at all??
Thanks for any comments!REPORT ABUSEDecember 6, 2011 at 5:16 pm #99175
AnonymousInactiveDecember 6, 2011 at 5:16 pmPost count: 14413
Sigh there is a definate pattern over the past month…
must be talking to myself .. againREPORT ABUSEDecember 7, 2011 at 9:05 pm #99176